Locality chart as diurnal return

[John_Townley]

In the often in-vain vein of trying to tie together disparate techniques and applications in astrology, here’s a thought about a raison d’etre (or at least a mutual linkage) between locality charts and the concept of returns (solar, lunar, etc.). At its most rudimentary, relocation astrology is simple. You cast a chart for someplace else other than your birthplace but for the same instant in time to see where the planets fall by house and find out if some of your planets are more emphasized by the new coordinates. And AstroCartography is simply a map that allows you to spot where certain of your planets would be on an angle. It’s kind of like picking a good solar return. You can’t change the overall planetary relationships of the instant, but you can go somewhere for your birthday to get them in better relationship to the houses and angles.

But why does that mean anything? After all, unlike a solar return, where you can actually be there for the event, you were in one place and one place only at your birth, and travel doesn’t change that. Your real Ascendant will never change, wherever you go, so what’s the deal? Within the normal principles of astrology, why would going somewhere else affect your chart? If you knew why, you might be able to do much more with it. Most astrologers seem to think that relocation seems to work – I do, I can palpably feel it in some strong locations – but based on what principle? No one, to my knowledge, has suggested an answer to that (correct me if I'm wrong, this is not my specialty).

So here’s one, and it’s directly related to the solar return comparison, and simply based on the presumption that astrological effects are not only natal (where the principle of the evolution of initial conditions applies) but behavioral and are learned and increase over time. As we experience each planetary cycle (diurnal, lunar, solar) we become increasingly entrained by the experience, with each cycle repeat bringing reinforcement of the last and anticipation of the next. This is perhaps the bottom-line principle upon which return charts are based – the patterns surrounding each of these cycle re-beginnings (returns) gives an overlay of indicators about the coming cycle period, be that a day, a month, or a year (or longer for other planetary returns).

Now, it is widely held that you can alter the effects of a solar or lunar return by going someplace where the planetary pattern best fits the angles. But how about a diurnal return – the instant each day you’re exactly one sidereal day older, functionally defined by the moment your precise angles reappear at the place of your birth? You can’t exactly go rushing about to get each diurnal return optimized every twenty-four hours to improve each day’s outlook. But as it so happens if you go to someplace where, say, your “relocated” Mars is on the Ascendant, you’ll find that there the degree of your Mars is the Ascendant of every day’s diurnal return chart. You are, by daily repetition, having your Mars degree reemphasized every day, with each diurnal return. No wonder you can feel it! Your most fundamental and frequently-reinforced cycle has a natal Mars overlay, strengthened each day you’re at that location. The longer you stay, the greater the emphasis – it’s cumulative.

This is also a part of the larger picture of recurring degree areas and how critical they are on a moment-to-moment basis. When the degree of your Sun rises each day, your personality is emphasized, when your Saturn degree culminates you run into small but creeping roadblocks and restrictions, and so on. You can even rectify your chart by it. You may travel to get this phenomenon strengthened for the year on your birthday or for the month on your lunar return. But where you reside tells the story about the emphasis of the chart for the day, each day, and that is depicted by the simply-recast relocation chart – which by itself is a mathematical shortcut with no intrinsic meaning except that it conveniently tells you what happens there every day at your diurnal return. It doesn’t mean you have a new chart, only that this location affects your real chart selectively through daily repetitive occurrences.

Any thoughts on the matter?

John Townley
Sea Cliff, NY

[Ken_Gillman]

Hi John:

Your third paragraph troubles me. Perhaps I do not understand what you are saying.

Perhaps we should agree on terms.

By diurnal chart do you mean a chart set for the moment of birth but on another day?

And if my natal Mars is at 22 Scorpio, then are you referring to a location where a chart cast for my birth time on my birthday will have 22 Scorpio as the ascendant?

Unless you have definitions other than the above, your statement that “the degree of your Mars is on the Ascendant of every day’s diurnal return chart” would appear to be a load of codswallop.

I can only assume you were testing the group to see if anyone ever read these posts.

Sincerely,

Ken Gillman

[Ken_Gillman]

John:

I see that we differ on the definition of the diurnal return.

Ken

[John_Townley]

I'm defining diurnal return as the moment each day the angles return to their natal degrees at the place of your birth.

[Ken_Gillman]

John:
I was away, thus this delay in responding to your post.
It prompted me to do some comparisons.
I took the births of my four children and the deaths of my parents. For five of these six cases I was at longitude 74W, for the other I was at 2W. The deaths of my parents occurred at my birthplace (0E). Three of the children were born at 74W, and the other at 6E.
For each of the six I calculated my diurnal chart in four ways: your method, the Sun retaining its birth angular distance to the ascendant, ditto but to the midheaven, and for the birth UT.
Each of these 6 * 4 charts was also calculated for birthplace, for my locality at the time, and also (on the single occasion that I was absent from the site of the event) the location of the event.
I made my judgment of the validity of each diurnal chart by whether or not there was an appropriate planet within five degrees of one of the angles.
My conclusion: birth UT at the birthplace was the hands-down winner.
This exercise was worth doing and I must thank you for stimulating me to do so.
Up until now I used birth UT at the locality. I will now change my approach.
I continue to be a strong advocate for the relocated chart. For diurnals, it is just does not as good as birthplace.
Regards
Ken

[John_Townley]

Ken,

Thanks for taking the time to take an actual look based on my speculation, despite your initial reaction (we former colonists so seldom come across the word “codswallop”!). Of course, my definition of diurnal return, if one accepts it, makes the locational chart of necessity just what I said it was. And since most people use the Sun position to define diurnal return, not the repeat of the angles, in a way, your first inclination that it was a test to see if anyone was listening was correct!

But I’m very glad you were listening and, in your last note, if you mean to define “UT at the birthplace” as birthplace UT-LMT, then perhaps there is indeed something previously-unnoticed going on here that gives a more universal (and perhaps remotely causal) connectual context to locality and return charts. Even if not, as you say, your being stimulated to take a look and find fresh results is a good thing for all of us and one of the reasons for the cyber-revival of ACT.

Cheers,

John

[David_Monroe]

John, let me make sure that I understand you correctly. You said, "I'm defining diurnal return as the moment each day the angles return to their natal degrees at the place of your birth."

1) For a person living at/near their birth location, the realignment of their natal angles would occur a bit later each day and the Sun's position would shift almost a degree further from the MC, slowly making its way around the chart over the course of the year. In effect, this would be much like a transit chart.

2) For a person living elsewhere, at/near the same latitude, there would be just a shifting of house/orientation for natal and transiting planets --- and therefore a differing experience format for them. Still, however, a transit chart for a relocation.

3) For a person living away from the same latitude, one would have to choose either the MC or the Ascendant angle to orient the chart.

I don't generally use diurnal charts --- the type where the MC is progressed by the Solar Arc or some similar value. I do use a form of the Siderealist's PSSR charts which are, in essence, a diurnal chart which has its MC defined by the S/R MC movement from year to year (about 450 degrees per year). These types of charts focus on angular planets (natal, solar return or transiting) to emphasize which patterns are most likely to show up in one's experience that day. In effect, these are also a diurnal chart which is, IMHO, effective in showing which potentials found in the natal chart are likely to be experienced on a given day. Have you worked with these? Dave