Hellenistic Decans

[Therese_Hamilton]

I've been re-reading material on the decans, and have found the commentary supposedly linked to the Zoroastrians the most interesting and provocative. Since I am not familiar with the Greek language, I'd like to ask if Mr. Schmidt or someone else can answer some questions about these assignments. If there is no comment or question after a decan name, it means that the assignment deity is self-evident. I've noted the meanings of the less familiar names and bolded the questions.

THE 36 "AIRS" of the ZODIAC attributed to the "Zoroastrians."
From The Astrological Record of the Early Sages in Greek, translated by Robert Schmidt, Vol. X of the Greek Track, The Golden Hind Press, 1995, p. 25.

ARIES
1 Aidoneus (Another name for Hades)
2 Persephone
3 Eros

TAURUS
1 Charis (One of several charities)
2 Horai ("the hours": three goddesses who controlled orderly life)
3 Litai (Sweet-natured goddesses, whose special duty was to recompense the persons whom Ate had reduced to distress and ruin.)
(Note a Venusian tone to these decan guardians.)

GEMINI
1 Tethus (Q: Tethys? in Greek religion and mythology, a Titan, daughter of Gaea and Uranus.)
2 Kubele (Q: Cybele?)
3 Praxidike (The goddess of judicial punishment)

CANCER
1 Nike (Greek goddess of victory)
2 Herakles (Hercules)
3 Hecate

LEO
1 Hephaistos
2 Isis (Egyptian goddess of motherhood and fertility)
3 Serapis (a syncretic Hellenistic-Egyptian god)

VIRGO
1 Themis (One of the Titans. A stern Goddess of Order and Justice)
2 Moirai (The three fates)
3 Hestia

LIBRA
1 Erinus: (Q: Is this Eris? The Erinnyes?)
2 Kairos (God of the "fleeting moment")
3 Nemesis (Goddess of punishment)

SCORPIO
1 Numphai: Q: Nymphs?
2 Leto
3 Kairos (Q: This same "Kairos" is given as the 2nd decan of Libra. Is this a possible translation error? If so, would Kairos likely belong to Libra or Scorpio? What might be the replacement for the other image?)

SAGITTARIUS
1 Loimos (Pestilence, plague; Q: A god/goddess??)
2 Kore
3 Anangke (Necessity; Q: A goddess??)

CAPRICORN
1 Asklepios
2 Hugleia (Q: Hygieia??)
3 Tolma (Boldness, reckless audacity; Q: A god/goddess??)

AQUARIUS
1 Dike (Goddess of moral justice)
2 Phobos (Son of Ares, God of terror)
3 Osiris (Egyptian god of the afterlife)

PISCES
1 Okeanos (Oceanus, a Titan who personified the Ocean)
2 Dolos (Trickery, guile, craftiness and cunning deception; Q: A god/goddess??)
3 Elpis (A goddess, the personification of hope)

It's interesting that there are some Egyptian deities mixed in with the Greek, and that often the adjoining decans are very different from each other. This fragmant was published in 1995, and I'm wondering if there have been additional translations since then that might shed light on these decan assignments?

Thanks to Mr. Schmidt or anyone else who might be able to add additional information. So much of the material on the decans from other sources seems to make little sense with no apparent practical application to actual birth charts. But these assignments suggest clues that could be of practical value.

Therese Hamilton

[Dimityr Kojuharov]

I suggest you to search for the book which gives the most complete information about decans:

Wilhelm Gundel, Dekane und Dekansternbilder-ein Beitrag zur Geschichte der Sternbilder der Kulturvolker, Hamburg, 1936

The book could be found at the large university libraries, as Berkeley.
The book is 450 pages and has over 30 tables and diagram.

[Therese_Hamilton]

And this book is in German, which I don't read?? Also I no longer have access to the Berkeley library since I've left the San Francisco Bay Area. But thanks for the thought.

I apparently didn't make it clear that I was asking about alternate Greek name spellings. Some of the names weren't familiar to me, and I was hoping that someone more familiar with Greek mythology and the Greek language could clarify some of the identities.

Therese Hamilton

[Petri Laakso]

And this book is in German, which I don't read?? Also I no longer have access to the Berkeley library since I've left the San Francisco Bay Area. But thanks for the thought.

I apparently didn't make it clear that I was asking about alternate Greek name spellings. Some of the names weren't familiar to me, and I was hoping that someone more familiar with Greek mythology and the Greek language could clarify some of the identities.

Therese Hamilton

Dear Mrs. Hamilton,

I might help you a little with Mr. Kojuharov’s book suggestion.

Here are the chapter names of the table of contents of Gundel’s book, a fairly monumental tome in my opinion.

Part One: Decans in Ancient Egypt
Part Two: Decans in Antiquity, Middle Age and the Modern Era
Chapter One: The Concept of the Decanate
Chapter Two: History of the Names of the Individual Decans
Chapter Three: Pictures of the Decans in Occidental and Oriental Literature
Chapter Four: The Pictorial Representations of the Decan Gods and their Transformation in Antiquity, Middle Age and the Modern Era
Chapter Five: The Character, Scope and Manner of Influence of the Decans
Chapter Six: The Meaning and Effects of the Decans in Various Occult Doctrines

I understand you are looking for specifically Greek/Hellenistic variants of the decan names? There are several tables in the book that have to do with the decan names and their history.

* Gods assigned to the decans in Roman times (pp. 18-21). These are from Egyptian temples and seem Egyptian at a quick glance.
.
* History of the decan names (p. 45). This is a very general chart that begins from Ancient Egypt and takes it from there through history.

* Names of the decans (pp. 77-81). This lists 21 sources/columns of names for each of the decans. Some of these are in Latin letters, some in Greek. I think the list you have put forward from Mr. Schmidt’s translation is the one attributed to Kosmas of Jerusalem in this table. Gundel deals with this list on page 71. This list contains Egyptian, Ancient Greek and Hellenistic godforms mixed together, as can be seen in your list.

* The Spread of the Egyptian/Hellenistic decan descriptions through History (p. 92-93). In this more detailed chart Gundel derives the list of Kosmas from the syncretistic decan list of Zarathustra and his son. Zarathustra’s list he in turn considers to have come from an unknown intermediary source that itself derived from the “original” conception.

As to the specific questions you made, here is what Gundel has at the places you asked about (there are some different transliterations).

GEM 1: Thetys
GEM 2: Kybele
LIB 1: Erinys
SCO 1: Nymphen. I’d vote for the nypmhs here.
SCO 3: Kairos
SAG 1: Loimos
SAG 3: Ananke. I would personally suppose this is the Greek Goddess of Fate.
CAP 2: Hygieia
CAP 3: Tolma
PIS 2: Dolos

I don’t think any of the other lists are close enough in themselves to directly shed much light on the one you are working with. A detailed comparison of all, as in Gundel’s tome, might help some, but they do seem to differ quite a bit.

I know it’s not much help, but maybe some perspective.

With best wishes,

Petri

[Therese_Hamilton]

Thank you so much, Mr. Laakso, for your very helpful and detailed reply. You have cleared up most of the confusion. I have one more question about Libra 2, which Schmidt's list gives as Kairos, the same as Scorpio 3. Do the lists shed any light on whether there might be another assignment for Libra 2 or Scorpio 3?

I spent two years in Germany. Such a pity that I didn't learn the language well enough to remember it some years later after returning to the U.S. Gundel’s book does indeed sound like a wonderful source for the decans.

Many thanks for your help.

Therese Hamilton

[Petri Laakso]

Dear Mrs. Hamilton,

The Kosmas list does give Kairos for both, so no help there.

Here are Kircher's and Welper's lists which have at least some Greek names in them, but they are both much later than Kosmas.

Kircher / Welper

ARIES:
Arueris / Saturnus
Anubis / Jupiter
Horus / Mars

TAURUS:
Serapis / Sol
Helitomenos / Venus
Apopis / Mercurius

GEMINI:
Tautus / Luna
Cyclops / Apollo
Titan / Hercules

CANCER:
Apollun / Castor
Hecate / Pollux
Mercophta / Arctus

LEO:
Typhon / Orion
Peroeus / Cepheus
Nephthe / Arctophilax

VIRGO:
Isis / Perseus
Piosiris / Orpheus
Cronus / Neptunus

LIBRA:
Zeuda / Pluto
Omphta / Agymech
Ophionius / Atlas

SCORPIO:
Arimanius / Cynosura
Merota / Vulcanus
Panotragus / Pan

SAGITTARIUS:
Tolmophta / Regulus
Tomras / Sirius
Teraph / Procyon

CAPRICORN:
Soda / Aldebaran
Riruphta / Aeolus
Monuphta / Ophiuchos

AQUARIUS:
Brondeus / Bacchus
Vucula / Antares
Proteus / Rigel

PISCES:
Rephan / Antinous
Sourut / Sagittarius
Phallophorus / Aquarius

[Therese_Hamilton]

Dear Mr. Mr. Laakso,

This is a very strange list, indeed! For me the Kosmas list has much more the ring of authenticity about it, especially since the same source gave the following co-inhabitants of the signs, of which Apollo/Sun, Poseidon/Zeus and Hades/Ares are particularly interesting:

Solar Half of Zodiac:
-------------------
Leo: Apollo with the Sun
Virgo: Muse [who inspired poetry and the arts] with Hermes
Libra: Anteros [brother of Eros, god of love] with Aphrodite
Scorpio: Ate [goddess of mischief and rash action] with Ares
Sagittarius: Hera with Zeus [both having to do with the legal tenets of society]
Capricorn: Rhea with Kronos

Lunar Half of Zodiac:
--------------------
Aquarius: Artemis [who lived remote from mankind] with Kronos
Pisces: Poseidon with Zeus (modern assumed rulership)
Aries: Hades/Pluto with Ares (modern sidereal rulership)
Taurus: Imeros [god of desire] with Aphrodite
Gemini: Nephele [a phantom-like woman] with Hermes
Cancer: Moon (Sun)

One can see some logic in some of these assignments as well as the Kosmas decan lords, so I'll continue my research along these lines. It would seem that traits connected with deities must in some way be expressed in planetary stelliums in the signs/decans. Perhaps all of the different decan associations simply reflect astrological experimentation in those ancient times, much as today's astrologers often seem to write spontaneously without thought or grounding in research.

Again, I very much appreciate your help.

Therese Hamilton

[Joseph Ledzion]

My own 2 cents..

The decans that make the most sense to me are arranged unambiguously by triplicities, so that the decans of all Fire images are arranged in the following order: Ares, Sol, Zeus; Earth signs: Aphrodite, Hermes, Kronos; Air: Hermes, Aphrodite, Kronos; Water: Luna, Ares, Zeus. So, for example, the first decan of the Water pourer is Hermes, the second decan of Sagittarius is Sol.

When I discovered this system, it was tied to Manilius. I am not sure if that is true.

I used to use the decans in Medieval astrology, essentially to prevent a planet from being peregrine, but seeing how point schemes effectively dismantle the integrity of original Hellenistic principles, related to the meaning of a planet being in its own places, I have since abandoned the use of Decans altogether, not sure of their use.

The reports that early Hellenistic astrologers where using the decans to make predictions is intriguing, and we see as late as Lilly's time that the decans were used for predictions, particularly in regards to eclipses.

Joseph

[Therese_Hamilton]

Here is a footnote regarding decans in James Herschel Holden's A History of Horoscopic Astrology:

"Late twentieth century astrologers have generally adopted the rulerships invented by the Hindus, which assigns the first decan to the sign itself and the second and third to the signs of its triplicity. This scheme is found in the Greek text of Achmat the Persian (9th century?). However, it seems to have been first introduced into Western astrology by Alan Leo at the beginning of the 20th century. (P. 93)

[Joseph Ledzion]

Here is a footnote regarding decans in James Herschel Holden's A History of Horoscopic Astrology:

"Late twentieth century astrologers have generally adopted the rulerships invented by the Hindus, which assigns the first decan to the sign itself and the second and third to the signs of its triplicity. This scheme is found in the Greek text of Achmat the Persian (9th century?). However, it seems to have been first introduced into Western astrology by Alan Leo at the beginning of the 20th century. (P. 93)

Ms. Hamilton,

Pardon me for not being entirely lucid on the point. I am also familiar with this adopted system of decans "from the Hindus." Let me just be clear in establishing that the system of decans I described above, which can be found in the settings of the astrological software ZET 8 labelled as those of "Manilius" are in fact not the same as the one's described in this passage by James Holden.

Manilius (according to ZET 8):

Fire = Ares, Sol, Zeus
Earth = Aphrodite, Hermes, Kronos
Air = Hermes, Aphrodite, Kronos
Water = Luna, Ares, Zeus

(all trigons follow this given order, which differs than the Hindu)

Hindu:

the Ram = Ares, Sol, Zeus
the Bull = Aphrodite, Hermes, Kronos
the Twins = Hermes, Aphrodite, Kronos
the Crab = Luna, Ares, Zeus

the Lion = Sol, Zeus, Ares
the Virgin = Hermes, Kronos, Aphrodite
the Scales = Aphrodite, Kronos, Hermes
the Scorpion = Ares, Zeus, Luna

the Goat Horned = Kronos, Aphrodite, Hermes
the Bow Shooter = Zeus, Ares, Sol
the Water Pourer = Kronos, Hermes, Aphrodite
the Fishes = Zeus, Luna, Ares

Again, it is unclear to me whether this system supposedly linked with Manilius is in fact his, and it is this I seek clarification for. So far, all the preliminary research I have done into the matter shows that Manilius' system of decans is related to Images, and not Stars.

Jim Tester in A History of Western Astrology says, on page 40:

"Here yet again Manilius preserves what must be an older tradition, in allocating each decan, each ten degree third of each sign, to the signs in order; most other, and all later astrologers attribute them to the planets. So, for Manilius, the first ten degrees of Aries belonging to Aries, the second ten to Taurus, and the third to Gemini; the first ten degrees of Taurus is Cancer's, the second Leo's, and the third Virgo'; and so on round the circle."

He goes on to say, that oddly,

"Manilius himself get the first two decans of Pisces wrong, allocating them to Aries and Taurus instead of Capricorn and Aquarius. He does not say precisely what the effect of all this is..." (emphasis mine)

Joseph